Roadmap Pardus-Anka

[evowinds]

Yes you are right for now but i think this explanation will form/reform the new project. It is dependable.
Wait and see what will happen...

[atolboo]

There is a hot news about Pardus.

Thanks for the info

What about the guys over at pardususer.de?

As I (and some other guys) maintain the repo overthere, I am part of that community.
They provide the required infrastructure to do the things I/we do.
I am also part of the NL-community and world community .
And the number of volunteers and most important software writers/experts is simply insufficient to keep Pardus going.
We can do our best to maintain/update it to a certain degree for a limited period.
But maintaining the core of the system is a different ballgame.
That are the facts in my opinion.

[jasperodus]

What about the guys over at pardususer.de? They are much larger. They also seem pretty skilled and dedicated. Could they take on that role perhaps?

I wish they did, but it looks they give up the hope (now I am talking about SW and LinuxFanatic)
Follow this discussion from page 23 to 25
http://forum.pardususer.de/index.php?topic=2513.330

Cripes, that was negative!

I think the 'blabla' was a bit off! And this 'Ha  - what community? - no one will join a community until there is a community...and fully staffed with developers etc, etc.'!! I mean, you are talking about starting something, and you are being told 'no, we won't join and create/build something (community structure/definition and leadership to begin with) and democratic)), because it doesn't yet exist' Chicken and egg scenario?

Oh, and: '...only 2 developers over at Anka...'. Well, that is 2 more than none

Also the point about problems with original project not accepting outside help: As you say, they were their own insular group and wanted to work that way.

The point about Mageia having a community, and it being democratic: Well, they did not branch from a much smaller and insular Turkish speaking (basically) group. They were a fair portion of the diverse and well established Mandriva community/developer base, so that is not at all a fair comparison/example given by SW at all!

I understand if some do not wish to stick with it any longer, and may have made substantial contributions thus far - but to say that the efforts made in trying to create some kind of (democratic) community structure is just 'blabla'...I'm sorry, that was not good.

Hmmmm?  

[richdb]

And the number of volunteers and most important software writers/experts is simply insufficient to keep Pardus going.

But maintaining the core of the system is a different ballgame.

You are right about that atolboo. But that is why we need a real community with roadmaps and structure.
And there are many ways to create a distribution.
The tools that make Pardus so special are written in Python, and Python run on every Linux system .

As you say, they were their own insular group and wanted to work that way.

Yes, and now we have as community the chance to influence, what a couple of users of pardususer.de allways wanted, and now they are so negative. I not get  that, they not even give it a try.
For the rest I totaly agree with you jasperodus.

[PhiX]

It's not the lack of users that bothers me, it's the lack of developpers. We are basically a community of users/contributors. Who knows how to build a Linux distribution ?

How could we recruit skilled and talented people ?

[dschzz]

It's not the lack of users that bothers me, it's the lack of developers. We are basically a community of users/contributors. Who knows how to build a Linux distribution ?

Well, most likely anybody who knows how to build a Linux distribution is involved in another distribution. Or retired.

How could we recruit skilled and talented people ?

I see only one possibility: Pay them. And that is most likely not an option.

Right now I get the impression that the things that make Pardus special may become its biggest disadvantage, because a lot of work is required to keep them up-to-date.


Maybe I was a bit exuberant when I discovered that the seemingly discontinued Pardus was (tried to be) taken over by a community. I thought that maybe I could help a bit. I use Linux since 1992, but my main language is C - and then Java, bash/ksh, awk, a bit of Perl. No Python. So I cannot help with the Pardus-special tools.

I understand that the original programmers are gone and don't want to come back. So, how many Python programmers are now within this community - enough to keep the Pardus-special tools alive and up-to-date* if they don't need to do anything else?


*: This includes the move from Python2 to Python3 that is needed just now, according to this post on forum.pardususer.de. I have no idea how much work it would be.

[richdb]

Translation of the press conference, My first feelings: Pardus is now officially dead (no development and support anymore) and the new king is Corporate?

Here it is:
<Pardus will go on with external resources>
President Candidate of TUBITAK ULAKBIM, Dr. Ahmet Kaplan explained that Pardus will have at most 5 core team and development will made by other corporations by using external resources. Kaplan also said that "Not all of our works will be on TUBITAK. We do not think to employ 50 of developers and do all the work on TUBITAK. We aim to do this on an ecosystem, by private sector. We still have contact with a lot of corporations. TUBITAK must not be at the center of this. This is, also, not OK. Our target is to create an ecosystem and make the ecosystem to continue healthily by some certification programmes. We want to cooperate with developers even more. At the FATIH* project it is called to research and develop (R&D). It is intended to support the systems that will be developed for FATIH project. We will also call for R&D for Pardus on embedded systems."

<Support for Solutions for KOBI (Small and Mid-sized corporations = SAMC )>
Kaplan, who mentioned that TUBITAk will support development on Pardus, also said that "We will largely support solutions that will meet the requirements of the SAMC. We want to have the free (as in free beer) alternatives of the software needed by entrepreneurs on Pardus. We want to spread a freely (again, as in free beer) available distribution that our people use. We also want to have a structure that will not seperated from the main Linux distributions and solve the problems of device drivers." Abdullah Erol, Project manager of Pardus, is also said that "We invite the corporations who developed solutions on Pardus and open-source to cooperate with us. We want to support the promotions of the software to the other corporations."

<New release is coming soon!>
Kaplan said on a question regarding whether Pardus is late on mobile version, "Not only Pardus, a lot of OS is late on mobile. The smartphone are nested with hardware. Manufacturer develop software that is compatible with hardware. We have to work in cooperation with hardware manufacturers. We will release a corporate edition of Pardus in 1 month. We are currently testing. To gather information on Pardus, pardus.org.tr can be used. We will start to send free ( as in free coke ) CDs to people who want it. We want to spread the name of Pardus by some educations and public advertisements and we want to have a call center for this purpose.

<Turkish language support will be increased.>
Kaplan who explains that their intent is to make the Pardus the OS that every citizen can meet ther needs and use also says, "We will coooperate with universities to increase Turkish language support. We will make students contribute on Turkish language support. We will have Pardus to have different wallpapers by theme competition. We aim Pardus to be completely Turkish (as language). The menus that are partially Turkish and partially English make us sad. We aim Pardus to be the best Turkish (as language) operating system. We intend the Turkish help files and books to be embedded into the system. We saw the lack of documentation. We want to publish books that will even contain base applications and publish them cheaply or completely free (as in free lemonade ).

<Consultation team set up.>
Kaplan has reminded that Pardus was a national operating system set up on 2003 to meet the needs of public by Govermental Planning Agency continued as "At 22th-23th of March we organised a workshop named Future of Pardus (Pardus'un Yarını Çalıştayı). By inviting people from the companies that use Pardus and from the public and all components of Pardus, we wanted to ask 'How to advance the Pardus project". At workshop, it is decided to build Consultation Comitee(Danışma Kurulu). Consultation comitee consisits of 8 people. It consists of delegates of the public, private sector, user communities, developers and users. There are only two members from TUBITAK. we take decisions by deciding with community."

<It spreads on public>
Mentioning that Ministry of National Education (MEB) has always supported Pardus, Kaplan said "Educations of Pardus will be given to local formatives and by formatives to teachers. MEB has leaded the use of Pardus on smart chalkboards. The first screen that our students face will be Pardus, our national operating system. Pardus is being used in all of the enrollment offices of Ministry of National Defence. By the new corportate edition Pardus will be used on 5000 computers of Ministry of National Defence." By the information from Kaplan, MEB, MSB, ISKI and RTUK (some govermental-public establishments) still use Pardus.

<There will also be Pardus in Smart Chalkboards>
Kaplan explained that they started to work to include Pardus in smart chalkboards that are disributed to schools by FATIH project. He also said, "Vestel(an electric appliances and electronics company in Turkey) has won the bid of 85000 smart chalkboard of FATIH. It was written as a requirement that both Windows and Pardus should be working on them. We worked with Vestel for Pardus to run healthily on the chalkboards. It passed about 150 of tests. Now there are 85000 of smart chalkboards that contain Pardus among tens of thousands of them. Finally it is decided to use Pardus in the smart chalkboards of FATIH. There will only be Pardus in 620.000 smart chalkboards." Reminding that mobile operating systems has been on foreground of the tablets of FATIH, Kaplan said that it is started to establish the mobile version of Pardus to use on tablets.

Foot note from the translator: <Those sentences> are sub-heads. ALL UPPER CASE words (as FATIH, MEB, TUBITAK etc.) are abbreviations of some projeccts and/or establishments of Turkey. FATIH is the project that involves tablets and smart chalkboards to establish technology-integrated education.

[PhiX]

Thanks for the translation richdb !
I really don't know what to think of such a big anouncement.

[atolboo]

Thanks and where can I the source of

Translation of the press conference,

[richdb]

Thanks and where can I  the source of

Here: http://www.melihbayramdede.com/pardus-dis-kaynak-kullanimiyla-yola-devam-edecek.html

Thanks for the translation richdb !

And we thank Semih İşeri for the translation.

[dschzz]

Hello Dirse,

Yes, pay money. So sad. Unfortunate. When money come, all magic gone.
We not demand perfect. We want amateur spirit. That make Linux perfect.
Windows/Microsoft, Bill Gates have many money. But never perfect.

In principle, Linux does not have the same problems as Windows. But it has other problems... As we see just now

Linus Torvalds say: "Personal honor".

Our only chance.

Tomorrow Turkish roadmap probably "bureaucratic". But we need "technical" roadmap.

Maybe we need both. By the way: Many thanks for what you already did for organizing things!

I still propose association in Netherlands / Germany. Because Turkey is confused, very political, oppressed by Bill Gates.

That is a pity. I would propose an association in Netherlands, because Richard is there and I got the impression from the German forum that they are not in the mood to help in any way. (Well, I'm German, but I have absolutely no knowledge about legal stuff, and I'm still at the very beginning with Pardus, too.) Right now I think that YOU are the most capable person when it comes to legal things.

[dschzz]

Translation of the press conference, My first feelings: Pardus is now officially dead (no development and support anymore) and the new king is Corporate?

Here it is:
<Pardus will go on with external resources>
...

<Support for Solutions for KOBI (Small and Mid-sized corporations = SAMC )>
...

<New release is coming soon!>
...

<Turkish language support will be increased.>
...

<Consultation team set up.>
...

<It spreads on public>
...

<There will also be Pardus in Smart Chalkboards>
...

Maybe I'm too gullible (again?) but that does not sound like the total death of the project to me. It sounds like great plans, the only(?) problem may be: Who will do it? Because even if most of the work is dedicated to other parties, there is still need for core developers who put it all together. And as far as I understand, they have just as much developers as we have here... But they have an advantage: Money.

[PhiX]

They have money, but they don't want to spend it on Pardus developpers. That's the big problem.

[richdb]

@dschzz, I also do not have knowledge about legal stuff, etc

Maybe I'm too gullible (again?) but that does not sound like the total death of the project to me. It sounds like great plans, the only(?) problem may be: Who will do it? Because even if most of the work is dedicated to other parties, there is still need for core developers who put it all together. And as far as I understand, they have just as much developers as we have here... But they have an advantage: Money.

It sounds politic . They introduce ideas like Pardus on the Tablet? And now they try to stimulate other parties
to develope parts of Pardus, but they still want have control of it? Do you know any company we work like that?

They have money, but they don't want to spend it on Pardus developpers. That's the big problem.

Yes, they got the best developers, who knows the in and outs of Pardus, but they fired allmost all of them?
So all those ideas are just double. And the Pardus we all know is official dead. There will be only a coporate edition. But how will this coporate edition look? And as community we not have the resourses to create a community edition of the Pardus we all know. Or all former developers must come back, but I am affraid they not gonna do that.

[atolboo]

..... I got the impression from the German forum that they are not in the mood to help in any way. (Well, I'm German, .....

I do not have the German nationality but are a member of the German forum.
And my assessment is somewhat different.
The German forum is a collection of people like this world forum is.
And they have a realistic view on the amount of resources available and draw there conclusion from that.
This is only my opinion.